Canine Bladder Cancer (tcc)

Hello Rock's Dad,

I am sorry to have to welcome you to this board.  We all do understand what you are going through; it is terrible news to get.  I am a fortunate one as my Annie's diagnosis came a long time ago and she is still with me.  I don't know anymore where her tumor has grown nor how large it is (once I knew we couldn't get rid of it, I didn't want to be thinking about it all the time) Annie has been on Piroxicam all this time and it has definitely helped her.  We have a doggie door so she lets herself out whenever she needs to. Sometimes it is every 10-15 minutes and sometimes it's hours.  It sounds as if poor Rock can't control himself at all.  

I have read about people devising doggie diapers for their pets  (if you look back through the postings you'll see it) It seems like a lot of work, but it also seems as if it was successful for the ones who tried it.

Annie goes to an oncologist who has told me that he has had some success with the tumors when they have progressed to blocking the canal and making it impossible for the dog to pee--when he catheterizes them, it has sometimes moved the tumor just enough to get then to pee better on their own.  I may not be explaining this properly and  it is more of a last ditch effort, but I thought you might want to ask about that.  We'll hope that the Piroxicam works for Rock and gives him some relieve.

Good luck to you.

Marty 

On 2/4/2005 Nannyno wrote:

I have a Sweet sweet sweet, ten year old Rhodesian Ridgeback named Diva. She is fighting the big fight right now, Tranitional cell carcinoma, in her bladder(4cm x5cm). She was diagnosed a month ago, and is asymtomatic except for bloody urine. She is in no apparent discomfort. I am giving her Piroxicam, an nsai, and have been for one month. Her regular Vet. insists it will see her through the major discomfort down the road...until she can no longer tolerate it. Without an operation, we want to shrink her tumor and slow it down, (irradicate would be BEST) with Graviola. Don't know how much to give a 75 pound girl. Does anyone out there have any experience with giving it to a dog? SO Gratefully Yours, Nannyno

The vet is amazed, I only hope her good fortune will continue.  This graviola has worked wonders.  You can reach me at

.  I also am giving her 3 drops of BSST an herbal supplement  3 times a day, you can get at Only Natural .com.  When ordering the graviola please reasearch the prices. I have used the cheapest with obvious results.  Good luck

On 2/4/2005 Nannyno wrote:

I have a Sweet sweet sweet, ten year old Rhodesian Ridgeback named Diva. She is fighting the big fight right now, Tranitional cell carcinoma, in her bladder(4cm x5cm). She was diagnosed a month ago, and is asymtomatic except for bloody urine. She is in no apparent discomfort. I am giving her Piroxicam, an nsai, and have been for one month. Her regular Vet. insists it will see her through the major discomfort down the road...until she can no longer tolerate it. Without an operation, we want to shrink her tumor and slow it down, (irradicate would be BEST) with Graviola. Don't know how much to give a 75 pound girl. Does anyone out there have any experience with giving it to a dog? SO Gratefully Yours, Nannyno

The vet is amazed, I only hope her good fortune will continue.  This graviola has worked wonders.  You can reach me at runt30551@yahoo .com.  I also am giving her 3 drops of BSST an herbal supplement  3 times a day, you can get at Only Natural .com.  When ordering the graviola please reasearch the prices. I have used the cheapest with obvious results.  Good luck

I wanted to share with everyone here what my experience with my baby Kobi has been so far so maybe it will help someone.

 Kobi was diagnosed with bladder cancer in  September '07.  His was in a place that they recommended surgery.  We operated and unfortunately he did not have clean margins (they weren't able to get it all).  They then recommended chemo (at $1,000 per treatment) with no guarantee it would help and definitely would not cure him.  I decided against the chemo and instead have been giving him the following:

Piroxicam, mushrooms, Cell Guard (to boost immunity), Pepsid AC, Echinachea and Goldenseal drops in his water, an herbal mix called Phytomucil that consists of Slippery Elm, Licorce Root, and Marshmallow to coat his stomach from the Piroxicam.  It seems to work very well.  Kobi got pretty sick initially from the Piroxicam but now seems to be doing great.

He's been on antibiotics a couple of times for what appears to be infections.  His diet is strictly protein (raw food and all protein treats).

The problem Kobi is experiencing now is when he pees, it's really long but most of the time nothing is coming out.  He obviously feels he is not empty and continues to try to go.  It's hard to watch but he doesn't seem to be in any pain.,

Has anyone else experienced this problem and what you have done to help bring relief?  Thanks so much!

 I am including links for a couple of the supplements I am using for anyone interested:

http://www.herbspro.com/shop/productdetail.asp?ptid=14275&am

http://wellvet.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&St

http://www.onlynaturalpet.com/products/Animals-Apawthecary-- I use the drops

My thoughts and prayers are with everyone here

 Robin 

Hi Robin--

I'm so sorry to hear about your Kobi; this is a dreadful disease.  I'm curious how you first learned he had it since the symptoms you are describing (his inability to pee) is often the first clue that there is a problem.

With Annie it helps if she stops trying to pee and take a few steps and tries again.  She started doing this on her own  and it made a huge difference.  The vet said  the placement of the tumor keeps her from being able to put the right pressure on the bladder (I hope I'm saying that right). Once she has been able to empty what she can, nothing more is going to happen--for her at least.  So she stops, walks a bit, and starts again, and she can pee. Sometimes it takes a couple of starts and stops and sometimes her first try is a successful one.

Obviously, you don't want to be pulling poor Kobi all over the place, but if nothing is happening you might try to encourage him to walk around and he'll try again on his own, I bet.

Good luck to you.

Marty 

On 1/14/2008 Gentleannie wrote:

Hi Robin--

I'm so sorry to hear about your Kobi; this is a dreadful disease.  I'm curious how you first learned he had it since the symptoms you are describing (his inability to pee) is often the first clue that there is a problem.

With Annie it helps if she stops trying to pee and take a few steps and tries again.  She started doing this on her own  and it made a huge difference.  The vet said  the placement of the tumor keeps her from being able to put the right pressure on the bladder (I hope I'm saying that right). Once she has been able to empty what she can, nothing more is going to happen--for her at least.  So she stops, walks a bit, and starts again, and she can pee. Sometimes it takes a couple of starts and stops and sometimes her first try is a successful one.

Obviously, you don't want to be pulling poor Kobi all over the place, but if nothing is happening you might try to encourage him to walk around and he'll try again on his own, I bet.

Good luck to you.

Marty 

 

 

 

Hi Marty,

Thanks so much for your reply. I guess I wasn't clear with what Kobi's problem is.  He actually pees a complete pee but then stay in that position even when he's done (which I know he is because ALOT has come out) and that's when nothing more is coming out.  So he's done, but doesn't think he is.  He actually has no problem at all peeing, he goes all the time very easily!  Kobi had his tumor removed surgically as it was in a place they could operate.  Unfortunately they weren't able to get it all though so it's there still, alot smaller now than before the surgery but of course it can and probably will grow again.

 I wish you all the best, it really is a horrible disease.

Warmly,

Robin

NOW I get it!!! But I have to tell you we are so used to that behavior, I've almost forgotten it is NOT normal. (Over Christmas, my brother in law was reading in the backyard and came in to report the "strangest thing" Annie was standing out there with her tail up as if she was peeing, but  nothing was happening!!! I looked at him as if he was demented and explained it was a symptom of her bladder cancer!! )

Annie is a scent hound, but that tail is up so often she looks more like a pointer!  I think that both Annie and Kobi feel extra pressure from the tumor and even though they have finished peeing, they keep trying. I have seen other owners write and say that is is a very sad thing to watch when this happens with their dog, but Annie doesn't appear to mind in the least.  We have a doggie door and she'll be out in the backyard all the time, sniffing around and the smells make her want to pee, and she thinks she can, but there's nothing there.  I am SO used to watching this that I think nothing of it.  I take her to work with me where she has to "ask" to go out and there we do much better. But still, she'll often continue to squat when she's finished.  If I am busy I have to urge her to finish up so we can get back inside. I then reward her with a cookie.  I don't necessarily recommend this, however, as she now asks to go out just so that she can come in for the cookie!!

Anyway, if Kobi can empty his bladder, I wouldn't worry about a thing.  Our oncologist has told me that this is the most important thing of all--they MUST get that urine out of themselves. If they can do it in one try, fabulous. If it takes a couple of tries, you're still okay. (Actually there are other things to worry about, but that's another subject) So I'd give Kobi a little more time, but if nothing else is happening, just  distract him with something else and move on!

Hope this helps--give Kobi a treat from Annie

Marty 

On 1/14/2008 Gentleannie wrote:

NOW I get it!!! But I have to tell you we are so used to that behavior, I've almost forgotten it is NOT normal. (Over Christmas, my brother in law was reading in the backyard and came in to report the "strangest thing" Annie was standing out there with her tail up as if she was peeing, but  nothing was happening!!! I looked at him as if he was demented and explained it was a symptom of her bladder cancer!! )

Annie is a scent hound, but that tail is up so often she looks more like a pointer!  I think that both Annie and Kobi feel extra pressure from the tumor and even though they have finished peeing, they keep trying. I have seen other owners write and say that is is a very sad thing to watch when this happens with their dog, but Annie doesn't appear to mind in the least.  We have a doggie door and she'll be out in the backyard all the time, sniffing around and the smells make her want to pee, and she thinks she can, but there's nothing there.  I am SO used to watching this that I think nothing of it.  I take her to work with me where she has to "ask" to go out and there we do much better. But still, she'll often continue to squat when she's finished.  If I am busy I have to urge her to finish up so we can get back inside. I then reward her with a cookie.  I don't necessarily recommend this, however, as she now asks to go out just so that she can come in for the cookie!!

Anyway, if Kobi can empty his bladder, I wouldn't worry about a thing.  Our oncologist has told me that this is the most important thing of all--they MUST get that urine out of themselves. If they can do it in one try, fabulous. If it takes a couple of tries, you're still okay. (Actually there are other things to worry about, but that's another subject) So I'd give Kobi a little more time, but if nothing else is happening, just  distract him with something else and move on!

Hope this helps--give Kobi a treat from Annie

Marty 

 

Hi Marty,

Thanks for the reply.  I guess if that's the worst thing, you are right, it's not so bad.

We had a terrible incident this weekend and I was wondering if anyone else has experienced this.

Kobi was vomiting up fecal matter, three up about 6-7 times.  It was heartbreaking to watch.  He then stopped.  I rushed him to the vet as I was told this is a medical emergency, fear of an obstruction in the intestine.

They didx-rays. saw something suspicious in his large intestine and kept him for observation that day.  They did more x-rays later that day and it showed whatever had been there had moved out.  We are lucky that he did not vomit anymore and has been able to keep food down (bland diet).

He seems ok now (one day later).  The vet has no idea what it was that caused the vomiting.  Kobi had been having perfectly normal bowel movements, one even just the night before (vomiting started early the next morning).  I am told these kinds of things can just come out of no where, one minute they are perfectly fine and then WHAM!

Kobi has been having gastro intestinal problems about once a month since being diagnosed.  I started doing the Piroxicam  weeks on and  days off to give him a break and that seemed to be working.

Has anyone else experienced this problem?

Thank you,

Robin

Hi Robin!

What a scary time that must have been for you. Oddly enough, I had just this last week been researching digestive problems and saw  that problem & I had never heard anything like it before!!! 
Whenever Annie has anything wrong with her, I assume it's the cancer, but it isn't --actually the TCC for Annie only shows in her peeing.  Anyway, the website said exactly what your vet said--a  blockage is what causes it.

It is definitely a serious problem and the fact that the blockage went away on its own is fantastic!!! What does your vet say now?  Is it possible (and I'm just throwing this out here) that Kobi needs more fat in his diet?  I have to think it wasn't a foreign object that he ate, or the vet would have been able to see it on the xray.

I hope this is all in the past for you, I know you have enough to worry about as it is.

Good luck, Marty 

On 1/22/2008 Gentleannie wrote:

Hi Robin!

What a scary time that must have been for you. Oddly enough, I had just this last week been researching digestive problems and saw  that problem & I had never heard anything like it before!!! 
Whenever Annie has anything wrong with her, I assume it's the cancer, but it isn't --actually the TCC for Annie only shows in her peeing.  Anyway, the website said exactly what your vet said--a  blockage is what causes it.

It is definitely a serious problem and the fact that the blockage went away on its own is fantastic!!! What does your vet say now?  Is it possible (and I'm just throwing this out here) that Kobi needs more fat in his diet?  I have to think it wasn't a foreign object that he ate, or the vet would have been able to see it on the xray.

I hope this is all in the past for you, I know you have enough to worry about as it is.

Good luck, Marty 

Hi Marty,

 No, there was no foreign object but unfortunately they have no idea what caused the vomiting.  It is usually caused by a blockage that can come out of no where and also can go away on it's own.  Many times it requires surgery so I was very lucky so far.

My vet really has no idea.  It's frustrating.  I am waiting to hear back from him again today and I also left a message with my holistic vet that I have been working with.  I am concerned it could be the Piroxicam, which would be terrible because I know how much it has helped other dogs.    I only think this because I always hear that this medication can cause gastrointestinal problems.  I am very careful with giving Kobi Pepsid AC one hour before giving the Piroxicam along with an herbal supplement (slippery elm, marshmallow, and licorce) to protect his stomach.

Thank you again for your care and concern.

Warmly,

Robin