bone pain

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RE: bone pain

by tomatoman on Mon Feb 19, 2018 04:41 AM

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CalBear

Go Bears! I also graduated from Cal, in '69. I bought some IP6 months ago after reading your post.  I think you are saying it takes a lot.  The pills I have are just 500mg capsules.  I tried taking it for a bit and didn't keep on it.  The thing is my lycopene therapy is working so like they say 'if it aint broke don't fix it." Seems it works differently than lycopenes and also takes a ton of it to work so I set it aside.  Not sure about it.

RE: bone pain

by CalBear1974 on Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:49 PM

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Great to hear from a self-admitted Cal bear.

You are right about IP6. It takes a heavy dose in my case to overwhelm the cancer cells. Everyone will be different and I always urge fellow prostate cancer patients to take the powder and be ready to increase it until you see results that you and your doctor would consider "surprising". 

I get my lycopene through spaghetti sauce (I prefer Arrabiata on Ronzoni's SuperGreens pasta offering a vegetable content). I am also taking Life Extension's "European Milk Thistle with Isosylibin A and Isosylibin B". Turmeric and capsaicin/Cayenne pepper are in my regimen.

On an empty stomach very early in the morning I take 1.5 grams of beta 1,3-D glucan from Transfer Poiint. I follow Dr. Vaclav Vetvicka's recommendation to take it with resveratrol and vitamin C. You want to read his "Beta Glucan: Nature's Secret". You can also see him interviewed at vitawithimmunity.com

Hope this is useful to you.

RE: bone pain

by tomatoman on Fri Feb 23, 2018 03:29 PM

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CalBear:

I have a problem with intestinal bleeding which came from an old wound and seems to not heal but worsens with blood thinners.  It seems to also worsen with IP6. In addition I have opsopenia.  So I am going to discontinue use of IP6 after two days of use..

In researching side effects of IP6 I found this:

https://www.webmd.com/vitamins-supplements/ingredientmono-77

"P-6 is safe when used in amounts found in foods. There isn't enough information to know if it is safe when used in medicinal amounts.

Special Precautions & Warnings:


Clotting disorders: Test tube studies suggest that IP-6 can slow blood clotting. Although this effect has not been shown in humans, experts recommend that people with clotting disorders avoid using IP-6.

Iron-deficiency anemia: IP-6 binds with iron in the gastrointestinal (GI) tract. This reduces the amount of iron that the body absorbs from food and supplements.

Weak bones (osteoporosis or osteopenia): IP-6 binds with calcium in the gastrointestinal (GI) tract. This reduces the amount of calcium that the body absorbs from food and supplements. Reduced calcium can affect bone strength.

Surgery: Since test tube research suggests that IP-6 might slow blood clotting, there is a concern that it might increase the risk of extra bleeding during and after surgery. Stop using IP-6 at least 2 weeks before a scheduled surgery.

RE: bone pain

by jcr65566a on Sat Feb 24, 2018 06:21 AM

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On Feb 17, 2018 9:40 AM shellie12 wrote:

morning was looking advice if any one has pain with metastatic Prostate Cancer.. sorry i know there pain but what trying to ask is does it be there all the time.. my uncle is complaining of a sore hip and sometimes limbs and sometimes not. he say the pain is there sometimes. ando ther times he does not feel it. and does not feel it when laying or anything.  hes not every active. and last bone test was very good ...5 weeks ago

hormone treatment useuly works well for bone mets.  But if you want to stop the scondrys  B17 worked for me.  I bought aprecot pits Using a cofee grinder I ground up  two full tea spoons of kenals in a glass of fruit  B17 has no efect on the primery cancer only on the secondary cancers 

Ray  

RE: bone pain

by shellie12 on Sat Feb 24, 2018 06:28 AM

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thanks for ur reply it seems to have left him now think he maybe just hurt it  yes i have him on b17 seems ot be good and also on vit d  to  

RE: bone pain

by CalBear1974 on Sat Feb 24, 2018 02:43 PM

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Tomatoman,

Your problem with bleeding worsening with IP6 is consistent with Dr. Shamsuddin's warning that IP6 will reduce platelet aggregation (i.e., it acts like a thinner), thus, anyone on a thinner should first talk to their doctor about reducing any prescribed thinner to allow for IP6's effects. Stopping it is one approach of course. 

There are alternatives. Capsaicin (cayenne pepper powder) would seem inappropriate as it could aggravate your gut. Turmeric in heavy enough doses can help fight some cancers but it also thins the blood and should avoided.

The good news: Milk thistle does not apparently thin the blood. At least my Internet research does not identify any source claiming this. To fight prostate cancer 10 grams daily in divided doses is the approximate amount. That is the dose I take. As I have said elsewhere, the Life Extension European Milk Thistle with Isosylibin A and B is required for the anti-prostate cancer effects.

If I had the time, I would go through Shamsuddin's text and find his discussion of iron and calcium. My recent bone scan for osteoporosis found I had exceptionally strong bones. IP6 delivers calcium and magnesium atoms. From his website IP-6.net   "IP6 (or InsP6) is a 6-carbon-ring carbohydrate (inositol) with 6 phos-phate groups that are naturally saturated with Ca++ and Mg++. It was discovered in seeds in 1855-1856 by Hartig; because of its plant origin it was called 'phytin' and in 1910 its molecular structure as myo-inositol-1,2,3,4,5,6-hexakis dihydrogen phosphate was elucidated.

At his website you will get a short course in IP6, also known by physicians as "phytate". Dr. Michael Greger has made some excellent short videos on the medical benefits of "phytate" or IP6. Here is one that runs directly counter to your quote on weak bones: https://nutritionfacts.org/video/phytates-for-the-prevention

Here is one on phytate and normalizqtion of cancer cells (Dr. Greger calls it rehabilitation of these cells) https://nutritionfacts.org/video/phytates-for-rehabilitating

You should be, according to Dr. Greger and Dr. Joel Fuhrman, eating as much beans as tomatoes. A day doesn't go by without eating a big serving of beans. I get mine through homemaded vegan chili. My project today is a crockpot full of vegan Cuban black beans, rice and corn.

You might also enjoy this video: https://nutritionfacts.org/video/phytates-for-the-prevention

Tomatoman, I wrote you a lengthy post 2 days ago. It has not been posted. I have written the webmaster about the posting failure.

RE: bone pain

by CalBear1974 on Sun Feb 25, 2018 02:21 PM

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Tomatoman:

My post that never got posted tried to explain the "scoop" equivalency in IP6 capsules. Since I wrote that post I recalled that Dr. Shamsuddin explained (I think it was in his book but I'm not sure) that one scoop equates to 8 capsules. Hence my twice a day dose of 8 scoops equals 64 capsules, thus 128 capsules daily. To get the grams you multiply through by the grams per capsule, which off the top of my head, is about 6.7 grams. Rounding down to 6 grams to allow for flavoring and other additives, that is 6x128=768 grams daily. Yup, I visit the bathroom a lot. I deal with a lot of gas. But it is a nontoxic homemade chemo treatment. Yes, it costs a significant amount but funerals are more expensive.

RE: bone pain

by tomatoman on Sun Feb 25, 2018 03:40 PM

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Thanks CalBear;

I think I am happy with the effects of lycopene but I am appreciative of your information.  If you click on my name you will see my photo showing a scan last year which indicated some skull bone metastasis.  That was in August 2017.  But by late September, after extensive lycopene intake, they were unable  to find any trace of cancer on a metastasis bone survey.  So I think the lycopenes intake during August wiped out the smaller tumors.  I was checking my notes this morning and noticed that I was taking tomato juice or V8 low sodium hourly during some of that time.  Also hot shower therapy might have helped. I am going in for a PSA check in the coming week and so I am going to increase my frequency of V8/tomato soup etc.  Hoping to rid my body of this condition but you know how it goes, "hope for the best but expect the worst."

I also find some messages take long times to  appear posted which is irritating.

RE: bone pain

by shellie12 on Tue Mar 06, 2018 08:32 AM

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On Feb 23, 2018 3:29 PM tomatoman wrote:

CalBear:

I have a problem with intestinal bleeding which came from an old wound and seems to not heal but worsens with blood thinners.  It seems to also worsen with IP6. In addition I have opsopenia.  So I am going to discontinue use of IP6 after two days of use..

In researching side effects of IP6 I found this:

https://www.webmd.com/vitamins-supplements/ingredientmono-77 5-IP-6.aspx?activeIngredientId=775&activeIngredientName=IP-6"" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">https://www.webmd.com/vitamins-supplements/ingredientmono-77 target="_blank" rel="nofollow">https://www.webmd.com/vitamins-supplements/ingredientmono-77

"P-6 is safe when used in amounts found in foods. There isn't enough information to know if it is safe when used in medicinal amounts.

Special Precautions & Warnings:


Clotting disorders: Test tube studies suggest that IP-6 can slow blood clotting. Although this effect has not been shown in humans, experts recommend that people with clotting disorders avoid using IP-6.

Iron-deficiency anemia: IP-6 binds with iron in the gastrointestinal (GI) tract. This reduces the amount of iron that the body absorbs from food and supplements.

Weak bones (osteoporosis or osteopenia): IP-6 binds with calcium in the gastrointestinal (GI) tract. This reduces the amount of calcium that the body absorbs from food and supplements. Reduced calcium can affect bone strength.

Surgery: Since test tube research suggests that IP-6 might slow blood clotting, there is a concern that it might increase the risk of extra bleeding during and after surgery. Stop using IP-6 at least 2 weeks before a scheduled surgery.

thanks very interesting read as is all the posts

Now am scared to use it on my uncle.. as hes 82 but on no meds for heart or thining meds. but does has a funny stomach  i appricate  .all replys 

RE: bone pain

by CalBear1974 on Wed Mar 07, 2018 03:22 PM

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Tomatoman,

I am negligent in not responding to your posting until now. There are some inaccurate statements made in your citations from webmd. Iron deficiency is not in vivo an issue when your IP6 source is the pure powder or capsules. The author has reviewed in vitro studies of inositol hexaphosphate ACID that found binding/chelating of minerals occurring. (Acid does not exist in nature and no patient would have an opportunity to use it as a supplement.) This included copper (CU), zinc (Zn), cobalt (Co), manganese (Mn), iron (Fe), and calcium (Ca). (From Shamsuddin, p. 106 in "IP6 & Inositol...") Listed in decreasing order of binding. These studies caused biochemists to conclude that IP6 was reducing bioavailability of minerals, that is negatively affect mineral absorption. But no, studies carried out with IP6 in its "purest form" indicate that the binding we who fight prostate cancer need to concerned with are protein molecules. (Shamsuddin, p. 107) I manage this problem by not taking IP6 until my stomach is empty (2 hours min.) I only take it with water (the powder or capsules) and don't eat anything for at least an hour. Dr. Shamsuddin points out that IP6 will REDUCE platelet aggregation, therefore anyone on a so-called blood thinner should talk to their doctor first because of this effect before consuming IP6. And of course it should not be taken before dental appointments or surgery. I hope this was helpful Tomatoman.

Have you ever tasted Rao's Arrabiata pasta sauce? The best ever.

Good luck.

Calbear74

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